Discussion Board Week 10.............

 
 
Picture of Michelle Wilson
Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Michelle Wilson - Sunday, 1 March 2020, 9:20 PM
 

Let's take one of our last discussion board opportunities to discuss what we as sonographers should be thinking and paying attention to, as we are tasked with scanning a multiple gestation. How might the parents be feeling while they are under constant scrutiny of their hopefully soon to be children?

 

 
Picture of Amanda Meadows
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Amanda Meadows - Monday, 2 March 2020, 5:42 PM
 

Although I love this topic of multiple gestations, scanning twins makes me nervous because it comes with twice the responsibility of checking the viability of these babies. Also, due to the 5x mortality rate in twins, I would go into the exam expecting an anomaly. Other than the normal anatomy we evaluate during a survey ultrasound (biometrics, maternal/fetal environment, etc..) we should thoroughly be assessing the chorionicity/amnionicity by looking for the thickness of the membrane near the placenta…. The “lambda/twin peak” sign or  “T” sign can help us identify if a twin pregnancy is Dichorionic/Diamniotic or Monochorionic/Diamniotic. This diagnosis is crucial because, as we learned today, there are more possibilities of anomalies with monochorionic twins because of the anastomosis of the vascular connections in the placenta. With this higher incidence of anomalies, I think that performing umbilical cord Dopplers would be beneficial to monitor blood flow in each of the twins. Making sure that we are labeling each fetus correctly, or following the labels from the previous sonographer, is essential. I couldn’t imagine mixing up the twins, especially if one had an anomaly. Another important parameter is to check amniotic fluid due to the fact that Poli-Oli and TTTS both have cases where one twin has an insufficient amount of fluid while the other has too much.

 *** Here’s where I have a question though, when doing AFI or DVP, would you do them separate for each twin’s gestational sac? I think this would make the most sense because it would tell you the fluid volume of each twin.***

I think the emotions of twin parents can vary, but I feel most would become exhausted having to get examined so often. I think this is important for us to remember as sonographers when scanning these mothers and realizing what they have to go through weekly. I think emotions may be heightened especially if this pregnancy is the first for a mother. Like Michelle said today, they probably go home and do their own research, like most patients do, and are aware of the risk factors of carrying twins rather than just carrying a singleton. I found a website called https://www.twiniversity.com/ that has resources for parents to access that help prepare them for pregnancy, delivery, post partum, and other factors after birth such as breastfeeding and stroller reviews. Of course, there are also many support groups on Facebook to assist mothers that are pregnant with twins. I always thought it would be nice to have twins, you know... two for the price of one! But after learning about the anomalies that can happen in singletons, just to find out they can happen more in twins, I think I’ll just be blessed with a healthy baby one day, no matter the number or gender!

Picture of Heather White
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Heather White - Wednesday, 4 March 2020, 5:44 PM
 

To answer your question, yes. When doing a DVP or AFI we would assess each amniotic sac separately. This way if there is a great desperity between fetuses it can be noted early and monitored. In the case of mono/mono multiples there is only one amnion, so still only a single DVP or AFI.

More often than not the poly-oli or TTTS difference in fluid would be treated by removing amniotic fluid from the polyhydramnios side. This would alleviate pressure on the other fetus. 

Picture of Amanda Meadows
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Amanda Meadows - Wednesday, 4 March 2020, 6:44 PM
 

Okay that's what I was thinking, thanks for clarifying!

Picture of Lizbeth Gutierrez
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Lizbeth Gutierrez - Thursday, 5 March 2020, 9:31 AM
 

Hello Heather I did too have a question in regards on how to go about obtaining DVP or AFi in cases such as multiple gestations! thanks much for clarifying I can see how identifying the type of placenta type is important when it comes to obtaining DVP/AFI due to fact like you mentioned with fetus sharing the same "house" amnion you'll only have to access a single DVP/AFI. 

Picture of jazmin vosley
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by jazmin vosley - Monday, 2 March 2020, 9:13 PM
 

Hello SonoSistas,

Before I got into this program I always seen pregnancy with triplets or twins as a blessing. I knew getting pregnant could be difficult. So when I saw a women carrying more than one baby in her stomach she stood out to me as a warrior. Now I know from lecture and reading multiple gestational pregnancy most commonly happen due to advanced maternal age, family history and assisted reproductive procedures. Also, the women that come in with multiple gestation pregnancys could have more anxiety than a woman with a singleton pregnancy because she is at risk for pre-eclampsia, prolapsed cord, and her babies having a congenital anomaly. She is probably also on edge about one of her babies not making it to term. 

As a sonographer, I would very much enjoy performing a survey on a multiple gestational pregnancy. I learn best by repetition, so if I had to scan a baby back to back three times in a row I image my images would show improvement. I would also be a bit nervous to scan a multiple gestational pregnancy because, if something is abnormal I would be the first to know. I would also be the first to know if there was a fetal demise because I would do a subjective assessment of the heart on each fetus before I began my exam. Then se if I can tell how the fetal demise happened was it twin to twin transfusion, trap syndrome (acardiac anomaly), or twin anemia polycythemia syndrome to name a few. Also determine which fetus is closer to the internal os (baby A).  When accessing a multiple gestation pregnancy, I think it is extremely important to be thorough and really see if you can evaluate chorionicity. 

 Here is something we probably won’t see in ultrasound but, just in case our patient has a history of some sort I think its good to be aware. Postpartum hemorrhage (PPH) I ran across it upon looking up differentials for multiple pregnancy concerns. The postpartum hemorrhage occurs when the uterus has grown extremely large (over distended) and the placenta is extremely large for the particular person (the mother) also the patient will bleed heavily after giving birth. 

https://www.aafp.org/afp/2017/0401/p442.html

Here is a couple of images of what these women can do for treatment if they face this complication after giving birth.

 

Reduction of uterine inversion (Johnson method). (A)The protruding fundus is grasped with fingers directed toward the posterior fornix. (B)The uterus is returned to position by pushing it through the pelvis and (C)into the abdomen with steady pressure toward the umbilicus.



Picture of Amanda Meadows
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Amanda Meadows - Tuesday, 3 March 2020, 5:17 PM
 

Hi Sono Sista,

I agree these mothers are warriors to not only go through the wonders of pregnancy but to also have double the trouble in that uterus! While it can be so overwhelming to have twins, I think it is truly a blessing for twins to be born without any anomalies due to the higher mortality rate they experience compared to singletons. The images you provided of the treatment of PPH caught my attention. At first, I don't know why, I thought something was being inserted into the uterus to absorb the collection of blood, but from the description it seems to be the uterus that is being inserted.....is that right?? If so, I think I may turn to a surrogate to have my baby for me one day (just kidding y'all).

Also, remember only dizygotic twins are hereditary, not monozygotic! Thanks for posting girlie.

Picture of jazmin vosley
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by jazmin vosley - Tuesday, 3 March 2020, 8:34 PM
 

your welcome, Yes those where different techniques, i thought it was pretty interesting(PPH)... yes on our homework there is a question asking about the division in reference to di/di twinning and the first thing that came to mind was dizygotic but then I had to reread the question and it said division so I put my answer as Monozygotic. Very important concept thanks, for bringing it to my attention once more hopefully now it sticks. I remember you asked those questions about amniocentesis. I was trying to find a live video an I ran across the most heartfelt video of amniocentesis it involves a 15month old with down syndrome.

 

https://youtu.be/bCqbJT5Kmsc

Picture of Amanda Meadows
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Amanda Meadows - Wednesday, 4 March 2020, 6:43 PM
 

What a cute little boy! Thanks for sharing the video jaz!

Picture of Heather White
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Heather White - Wednesday, 4 March 2020, 6:06 PM
 

Jazmin, 

My uterus hurts just looking at these pictures! Ouch! It reminds me of those damn fundal press things they do postpartum in the hospital to make sure your uterus is contracting properly after birth. Those things hurt so so so so bad. 

One thing we should be looking for is placenta accreta or percreta if it's severe. This is an overgrowth of placental tissue into and sometimes through the uterus. However, I didn't find any evidence suggesting muliple gestation pregnancy is at a higher risk. Previous c-section delivery does put a mother at higher risk and most multiples are born via c-section.

 

Picture of jazmin vosley
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by jazmin vosley - Wednesday, 4 March 2020, 7:46 PM
 

Hello Heather, 

yeah, it does look pretty painful. and this is why is is important to access the mothers anatomy as well as the babies. I like that you brought in placenta accreta , increta, and percreta. These are also abnormalities that may cause some bleeding and can be harmful to the mother if not caught in time. That also makes me think about subchorionic hemmorage of the placenta I also have not heard of mothers carrying twins at higher risk but it is a good differential to keep an eye out for when scanning a multiple gestation pregnancy. =)

Picture of Lizbeth Gutierrez
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Lizbeth Gutierrez - Tuesday, 3 March 2020, 10:02 PM
 

I believe the topic itself about multiple gestations is a bit frightening let alone scanning it. The fact that multiple gestations run way more 5x more fatality risk compared to a singleton. You not only assessing the well being of one fetus but two or perhaps even more! Nowadays people google everything prior to their appointment and get a range of possibilities thus you are to most likely have a anxious and nervous family in your room examining your every expression and the monitor. Before diving in I believe it is important to obtain history and any other tools that may help you predict prior to scanning. Keep in mind the following anomalies can occur with multiple gestations: stuck twin, acardia anomaly and conjoined twins. Maternal complications may include preclampsia, bleeding, prolapsed cord and as for the fetus may have to be delivered premature. Sono we are to first look at what kind of twins we are assessing. By that I mean are we looking at twins that share both amnion and chorion versus twins that completely have their own "housing" or a mixture as certain conditions such as sharing everything in the "house" are higher at risk and may need to be monitored as they run a high risk of mortality. keeping all that in mind as it makes a huge impact in furthering providing service for our patients and their little  ones. I have here a picture that can maybe help some of us with identifying the " housing " in multiple gestations .I'd also like to include the importance of identifying the t and peak sign as this is a sono sign that can help identify the "housing " that way you can better access the patient and little ones. 

Image result for monotwins versus diaImage result for t sign and peak sign sono

Picture of Charissa Velasquez
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Charissa Velasquez - Wednesday, 4 March 2020, 5:26 PM
 

I agree Liz! Its frightening, because its such a huge responsibility to not miss anything.  One "minor" mistake can change the course for the family and baby! Definitely being able to identify the chorionicity will help us as sonographers to being aware of more anomalies versus a common case of di/di. Even with di,di we still need to be careful, but with monochorionic there's more problems. Sharing one placenta and one sac can get too tight and cause entanglement of umbilical cords or TTTS. Once we figure the number of placentas and sacs it dictates what gear we need to get into. You mentioned some of the monochorionic twins. Poly-oli sequence and TRAP are also good ones :) 

Picture of Charissa Velasquez
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Charissa Velasquez - Wednesday, 4 March 2020, 5:19 PM
 

When scanning for multiple gestations definitely labeling the gestational sacs so there is no confusion of A versus B or C. We want to determine the chorionicity to figure out what type of pregnancy we are facing. Majority of pregnancies are dizygotic and under 1 % monozygotic. Whenever monochorionic we want to be detailed because anomalies are common with this type of pregnancy. My concern was confusing the babies along the way when they get bigger. However in class Michelle mentioned that they shouldn't move around to much. If they did, something was wrong. Also use reference whichever gest sac is closest to cx its labeled "AAA." Also with multiple gestations, being very alert with labs and the mothers clinical history. AFP is usually high with twins, but also AFP elevated is associated with anencephaly and spina bifida, so double check brain, spine and biometric measurements.  Also be aware of comparing gestational sacs. Eval if there is more fluid than the other. Is one bigger or smaller than the other fetus? The consistent evaluations of these multiple gestation pregnancies has the parents tense and anxious that something is wrong. A sonographer handling twin pregnancies will need to be more understanding with these parents because they're probably more emotional as well. It makes sense, if my babies were being evaluated frequently I would be panicking each visit that maybe this is the time when it all goes south. It's an emotional roller coaster.

Picture of Heather White
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Heather White - Wednesday, 4 March 2020, 6:13 PM
 

I agree these mothers of multiples generally are a bit more anxious than singleton moms. They know the increased risk with multiples. Their paperwork has high risk written all over it. Combined with the increased incidence of multiples with advanced maternal age or IVF adds to the anxiety. advanced maternal age comes with its own risk factors. A mother who has gone through IVF has done so probably after battling infertility and/or pregnancy loss. IF a mom has lost a pregnancy prior I can imagine she is preparing for the worst news at every exam. I know when I've done follow up visits in third trimester when I tell them the heart rate the mom will comment on it. Either saying its right on track or a bit low/high. If she seems concerned I will take another heart rate later in the exam and it's typically in the range she is more comfortable with. These mothers become so in tune with their bodies and their babies. They pay attention to movement patterns and do their homework, we owe it to them to offer them the best prenatal care possible. 

Picture of jazmin vosley
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by jazmin vosley - Wednesday, 4 March 2020, 8:01 PM
 

Well said Charissa,

These mothers can be emotional. Remember the most common reasons for a multiple gestational pregnancy is family history, advanced maternal age, and assisted reproductive therapy. So if the mother was coming in as a result of reproductive therapy she could have more anxiety about her unborn babies because of what she had to go through just to become pregnant. Also, I think it is important as a monographer to find out if the mother has any other children because if she has a multiple gestational pregnancy due to maternal age. She could also have anxiety because she's been trying to get pregnant, she's older, and just anxiety of becoming a first time mother of kids. I am really glad you touched bases on that. I also agree we should use Dr. Michelle's technique and label babies AAA,BBB. If something seems abnormal always keep the top twin anomalies in mind such as acardiac anomaly(baby not getting enough blood supply to upper body), twin to twin transfusion syndrome( the stuck twin(the donor is small and the recipient  is larger seeming from arterial to venous shunt) , and embolization syndrome(fetal demise has occurred with a monochorionic pregnancy and can possible harm the living fetus). 

Picture of Charissa Velasquez
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Charissa Velasquez - Thursday, 5 March 2020, 5:16 PM
 

Thanks Jazmin

I agree, with reproductive therapy she's hoping the embryos stay where they need to be to develop (fundus of her uterus).

Its an emotional time to scan pregnant women. There is so many backgrounds of how they became pregnant, cases of infertility, thought they were infertile but surprise, and even concerns from researching "what can go wrong when pregnant" online. Great explanations on the cardiac anomalies for monochorionic possibilities! 

Picture of Lizbeth Gutierrez
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Lizbeth Gutierrez - Thursday, 5 March 2020, 10:21 AM
 

Hello Charissa i completely forgot about the labeling thats a huge factor in multiple gestations as well! thanks for bringing it up! Great thinking that was my inital thought as well labeling the babies in such an early stage i thought they have a possibility of moving thus hard to keep track with the priors and distinguishing each fetus from priors. I didnt quite get the note of that typically that aren't to move if they do it's normal. I found this image in regards to labeling the fetus correclty!

 

Picture of Charissa Velasquez
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Charissa Velasquez - Thursday, 5 March 2020, 5:05 PM
 

Fantastic, I'm really digging the multiple gestation sonogram Liz! Yeah I would definitely check the placenta too for each gestation. We don't want to miss any potential placenta abruptions!

Picture of Heather White
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Heather White - Wednesday, 4 March 2020, 5:59 PM
 

When I showed up to clinicals Tuesday my lead was telling us she had scanned triplets the day before. She hadn't done one in years since often they are through IVF and are known and sent to a high risk center. She had to do some quick thinking about how to organizer her scan to answer any questions the doctors may have. It was difficult to tell the order based on proximity to the cervix since they were only about 8 weeks gestation so she did a sweep from rt to left and labeled them 1,2,3 from that order. She documented heart rate,CRL,yolk sac, and chorion for each. They appeared to each have their own chorion. These were also spontaneous triplets and the mother was sobbing during the entire exam. These were not tears of joy. She was worried and anxious. She was not expecting so many babies. It's unclear if she was unhappy about having too many or if it was also due to the high risk factor. I think simply because she didn't want three. With spontaneous multiples she may not be aware of the risk factors yet. 

That being said the pregnancy is at a much higher risk for fetal demise along with other complications with growth and moms health. Thankfully, because there didn't appear to be any shared chorion the risk factors are decreased since each fetus will have their own independent blood supply. This eliminates TTTS. 

Picture of Amanda Meadows
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Amanda Meadows - Wednesday, 4 March 2020, 6:34 PM
 

Woww triplets!? How cool, but how nerve-wracking being the sonographer responsible for this exam! Cool thing about first trimester with that exam is that you don't have to scan for 3 hours straight like you would for the anatomy survey. The numbering of each fetus would make me the most nervous because the all the sonographers after that have to follow my numbering.

Poor mama, I could imagine how overwhelmed she must have been feeling. It must have been hard for your lead to concentrate and perform the exam (TA and EV) while the patient was crying the whole time. I would want to rush to get the exam done but I would rather take my time to evaluate the chorionicity, amnionicity, CRL, fetal heart tone, and fetal numbering very thoroughly.

Thanks for sharing Heather!

Picture of Charissa Velasquez
Re: Thoughts on Multiple Gestations........
by Charissa Velasquez - Thursday, 5 March 2020, 5:09 PM
 

Wow so intense, such a cool learning experience for you. Keep us posted on that pregnancy! I'm wondering with triplets, if everything miraculously goes well will she deliver before 36 weeks?